Where do I begin?

Hi all,

Code:

 Skip this for a short version

I was hoping to read everything to get 90% of my information but I am already resorting to posting

My girlfriend and I are building a house and we are up to the electrical stage.

I have been doing some research the last few months as I am very keen for home automation :-D

I have been reading out HAI and ELK but then the electrical contractor sent us a "Clipsal Checlist" brochure and I am loving C-Bus. Particularly as it has been opened up like it has.

I am into IT, I will have several servers already running in the house [Asterisk, MythTV, OpenVZ] and therefore already lots of Cat6 planned.

Code:

Start here for the short version

I would like to get into playing with the C-Bus software and getting my head around it all but I am lost as to where to begin.

I read here:
http://www.cbus-enabled.com/cbus-open-a-desk.htm

And it sounded like I could stick C-Gate Server onto one of my Linux boxes. But going to the download page, I am lost as to what goes where.

I read here:
http://www.cbusforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2356

But found the link to learning about the Products, lists only Dimmer info initially leading to a web of docs and the demo software link is again a page of many pieces of software to download

I downloaded HomeGate [http://www2.clipsal.com/cis/technical/downloads/home_gate] and found it was a Windows executable.

So my long winded question is....where do I start reading and tinkering?
I am happy to learn myself and don't usually require being spoon fed and I do RTFM but where is it?

Any help kicking me off would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for reading.

 

Thanks for outlining where you've looked and what you've found. It sounds like what you're trying to do initially is get a C-Bus interface up and running on a linux machine.

If you're wanting to get a grasp of how C-Bus works and how it's installed, I'd start with the literature that goes with the C-Bus Training courses:
http://www2.clipsal.com/cis/technical/technical_support/training2/cbus_control_and_management_system

The primary C-Bus commissioning tool is the C-Bus Toolkit software. It is used for commissioning the majority of the devices on the C-Bus network. When you install Toolkit, it also installs C-Gate. Most of the other software products will talk to C-Gate to get information about the network.

C-Gate is no longer provided in a stand-alone installer so you'll need to install Toolkit on a windows PC to get it. Once Toolkit is installed you will have 2 folders in your C:\Clipsal folder, one for Toolkit and one for C-Gate. Inside the C-Gate folder is the PDF for C-Gate documentation. This document describes how to run C-Gate on a Unix-like platform. By default this PDF will be installed here:
C:\Clipsal\C-gate2\CGateManual.pdf

The other piece of software that is very useful to have is called PICED. It is used for commissioning a few of the more complicated C-Bus products like Touchscreens, Pascal Automation Controller and the Wiser.

Hope that's enough to get you started. Perhaps if you can say more about what you actually want to achieve, people will be able to point you more specific software or documentation.

 

Thanks for the prompt response Newman

Yes, I perhaps should have been more clear.

Well, like you mentioned, a general grasp of cbus and what all the "parts" are.

Specifically for our house we are building:
I want to learn now how to control it, what different ways I can control it. I want to be able to change the settings myself, saving my have to rely [time and money] on any other company to make changes for me. I want to have full control over my cbus install [being a FOSS guy I guess this is not at all surprising]

You have helped with the info provided. I will grab that doco and have a go at finding and downloading the Toolkit and see where that leads me.

Thanks Newman

 

All the C-Bus software products are available for download here:
http://www2.clipsal.com/cis/technical/downloads

 

Wow! Thanks for this valuable info.

I in fact downloaded the Toolkit onto my laptop while travelling on the Sydney rail system this morning.
I tried it in WINE. It did seem to hang when it came to driver installation, it did extract all the files. So I have this 310 page manual to read (just what I wanted) and the jar file.

I did get the jar to run (2.6.32 kernel) although it did not give back the same start up feedback the manual said it would, I was able to telnet in and run "noop"
WOOHOO!

I am on my way.

Daniel there sounds to be limitations if you don't have a Windows machine from what are saying. More reading for me to do.

PS while I have your attention, how exactly would my Linux box physically interact with the cbus network? I found some adaptors doing RS232, USB & RJ45.
Are they all available options under *nix?
I am betting RJ45 is the only one that works?.

Thanks again all.

 

Thanks Daniel

Reading "ethernet (CNI unit)" makes me breath a sigh of relief. Reads as it will be not too hard.

So I don't miss out on any features running off a Linux box?

Thanks for all the replies guys. Really appreciate it.

 

New user / CNI

Dave
I had the same situation as you.
I was new to C-bus and had no idea on how it worked and also I wanted to show the city inspector before we added because if declined It would be a disaster to re-wire back.

I made a quick mock-up to test and learn how to use the Tool-Kit on my Win PC using a serial RS232 CNI to communicate to my PC via a USB to serial adapter.

http://www.cbusforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4988&highlight=mock
It was very useful and did not cost much. Within a few hour I had a good understanding on how to do basic programming and start a whole house layout.
At this point I did not want to complicate things with PICED and using any touch screens as I was looking for simplicity. My thinking was once moved in I would go to the 2nd stage and learn PICED in which I did. I replaced a DLT keypad with a Mark II and programmed


Alan in Houston Texas

 

Thanks industeq

Can I ask why a "serial RS232 CNI" and not a 5500CN Network Interface?

Also, I will have cat6 running to all rooms, several sockets per room.
Can Cbus "piggyback" on to an ethernet network? I am reading something infering this in the manual, but it is not explained too deep so far.

Thanks!

 

No. C-Bus is quite different to Ethernet. Different conductors in the cable are used for different things. Even if you were able to completely isolate what the pairs were used for, you would very likely run into interference problems anyway. At the other end of the spectrum of problems, a wiring fault in your switchboard could make your ethernet network live. Save yourself a lot of pain and run C-Bus on it's own C-Bus cable.

 

Right. Cool.

So one would use the 5500CN to hook the Cbus network into the Ethernet network that a C-Gate server is sitting on?

Thanks again!

Reading the manual now in fact. It will probably tell me the answer

Thanks for all your help guys!

 

The serial CNI is RS232 and a down & dirty way to connect. Simple and old fashion but easy to set up for old timers .
However the Ethernet CNI will plug into your local network and can be accessed by a hub or WiFi to program. However the set-up for the Ethernet CNI is tad more complex.

In my application I started with a rs232 CNI as it is dedicated to communicate with a Square D PowerLink NF3000G3C

I also have a Ethernet CNI that I use to program.

For a 1st timer you could use either and both work fine to get a feel on how all the Clipsal units work.

As for cabling from the modules to the wall switches, Newman is correct. You do not mix your existing Ethernet wiring as the signal / control for the C-bus.
Once you read the basic training manual you will see that the pink Cat5 is wired for the C-Bus and isolated from the Ethernet. Where you are confused is mentioning about a Ethernet CNI, this is not for wiring to control but to access the C-bus / Clipsal for programming and the back-end. It has nothing to do with wiring of the switches and other Clipsal devices.

Alan from Houston Texas

 

I just want to clarify some terminology to avoid any confusion.

The term "CNI" refers only to the C-Bus Ethernet interface, i.e. the 5500CN. CNI = C-Bus Network Interface.

The term "PCI" refers to both the USB PC Interface and the Serial PC Interface, 5500PC and 5500PCU respectively. PCI = Personal Computer Interface.