What's Missing?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Conformist, Mar 26, 2008.

  1. Conformist

    Conformist

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Messages:
    760
    Likes Received:
    67
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    The whole concept of the MRA re-design was to address these main issues.

    1/ Improve the industrial design of the system (make it look more like an A/V product)
    2/ Add functionality without driving the cost up
    3/ Where possible, make the system more affordable
    4/ Fill gaps where missing products or weak offer (ie speakers)

    So....

    I thought it was about time to give a bit of a 'heads up' on the new generation of MRA products particularly if you are planning an install or undertaking 1st fix cabling.

    As Nick has highlighted, the Matrix Switcher will include a streaming client. You will be able to stream directly into the Matrix Switcher (from a PC running server software), MP3's .
    You will also be able to plug in a USB 'thumb-drive' into the USB port on the front of the unit. For the streaming capabilities, you will need to run a LAN cable to the unit.

    Secondly, the Matrix Switcher will also include dual AM/FM tuners. This capability was a very cost effective addition which added very little to the manufacturing cost. Well after the development began, digital radio was launched in Australia. There has been provision made for this technology, but at this stage it has not been implemented. Adding digital radio would have added about $150AUD (per tuner) to the system. The technology is still a little immature so it was decided to let it settle a little.
    Up to 16 tuner presets can be configured. Their description/station ID (ie MMM-FM, NOVA... you choose) can be brought up onto a touchscreen. The station ID can also come up on a DLT if so desired. The tuner(s) use a coax cable to the standard TV antenna. A word of note here... If you are installing a system where AM reception is poor to reasonable and the client definitely wants good AM reception, it is advised that a separate (possibly digital) Tuner is offered. There is IR control on MRA so you may be able to control an external tuner too. The Antenna connection is a little unique. In order for it to operate on AM, you will need to break the shield of the coax, but do it some point away from the A/V equipment. FM reception will work regardless of whether or not you break the shield, AM requires the shield to be broken (not a closed loop). If AM is not required, then this is not an issue. We'll provide more information soon in the installation instructions, planned to become available before the system is released.

    Thirdly, it's possible to mix and match the inputs into the Matrix Switcher. Previously, it was fixed as to what inputs were configured. Lets say you only require a single tuner and don't need the optical input either, you can option these out on the configuration setup. Your possible 'inputs' to the system are...

    4 x Analogue Inputs*
    1 x Optical Input
    2 x On-board AM/FM Tuners
    1 x On-board Streaming client....(optional)... if you don't want this, you can buy a standard Matrix that can be upgraded later
    1 x Digital Input (MRA type digital input, that is)

    *Note... There is a 3.5mm AUX input for MP3 players on the front of the Matrix Switcher that is in (electrical) parallel with Analogue Input #4

    Only 6 of these inputs can be used (you can also configure a local input on each amp for local personal devices to make 7 inputs) plus the annunciation input which is fixed.

    There is also (now) a C-Bus triggered doorbell feature. You can configure up to 4 different sounds to play, triggered by group addresses over the system. The doorbell does not count as one of the inputs.... a bonus!

    Other features of the system are.......

    The LCD screen on the front of the Matrix Switcher will show the current selected radio tuner(s) with signal strength. The backlight for this screen can be controlled by a C-Bus group address

    You can cycle through the radio station presets or you can select an absolute preset station

    There are now audio scenes available... ie at 6.00 am, switch on the bedroom zone ramping to 30% over 5 minutes on Nova FM.

    You can stream MP3's as well as Internet radio stations through the new server software (called C-Bus Ripple). Do this with schedules or include in a scene

    You can control C-Bus Ripple via C-Bus. You can play, pause, stop, next track, previous track etc.

    You can change playlists, Internet radio stations (cycle through them or select absolute presets).... M3u files supported

    On B&W MKII touchscreens, you will be able to see the current playing track, next track, next track +1, previous track and previous track -1.. all served up over C-Bus. You will not be able to send cover art over C-Bus, due to the bus spreed... sorry :( On the colour C-Touch, you will be able to see all that is available on the B&W plus cover art and a whole lot more in logic. Wiser functions will be similar to that of the Colour C-Touch


    I mentioned the Matrix Switcher has a new industrial design (see pic below). We also have a new low cost, amplifier. This amplifier is a high temperature rated device that can be installed in the roof-space or can be installed in a rack. If you gang 4 of the amps together (they have joining slots for this), four will fit nicely in a 19" rack or in an A/V equipment cupboard. These will be a lower price than the existing remote amps.

    The design is well and truly bedded down. I'm sure there will be a heap of suggestions on how the system could be made better and what we've failed to address. We did have serious constraints such as the cost, complexity and time to market.

    Finally, we needed to address our speakers. The sound quality of MRA is very good (not audiophile, that's not our market). We have entered into a partnership with Krix Loudspeakers who are IMHO, one of the best speaker manufacturers about. We are co-branding their in-ceiling/wall and outdoor speakers and making them available under the co-branded name. The speakers will still carry all of the Krix labels and badging, but will now be available through Cliipsal/Schneider distribution channels.

    Well, that's enough for now. If you are cabling for MRA though, remember to run the following cables..

    To the Matrix switcher-
    1 x LAN Cable (cat5e/cat6 whatever you run for your network)
    1 x RG6 quad shield to the TV distribution system
    1 x Cat5e (Digital Audio) cable to each amplifier, located either next to the Matrix Switcher or in the field near the speakers (suggest green colour)
    1 x C-Bus cable
    1 x Power Outlet


    To the amplifiers-
    -Digital Audio cable run back to the Matrix Switcher (as outlined above)
    -Speaker cable to speakers
    -Optional outlet for power supply (amplifiers are powered down the digital cable from the Matrix Switcher, but for higher power requirements, a local power supply may be desired)
    -Optional local input (for MP3 player)
    -IR target connection... MRA Supports IR reticulation (with new lower priced, IR targets and emitters to come shortly)

    More to come as we get closer :)
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 27, 2010
    Conformist, Nov 24, 2009
    #81
  2. Conformist

    P2T

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2009
    Messages:
    24
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Perth, Western Australia
    Hi Conformist,

    Thank you so much for the details on this new product; I am well and truly integrating this into my C-Bus build and I am sure it will become a default option for many given the enhancements. Your cabling guide is particularly helpful for me at this stage!

    One question not answered in the above - does the unit still provide power to the C-Bus network via an in-built C-Bus PSU?

    Thanks,
    P2T
     
    P2T, Nov 24, 2009
    #82
  3. Conformist

    Conformist

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Messages:
    760
    Likes Received:
    67
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    Good question...The C-Bus Power supply has been removed from the Matrix Switcher. This has been asked for repeatedly. It also helps reduce the cost of the product

    Cheers
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2009
    Conformist, Nov 24, 2009
    #83
  4. Conformist

    Charlie Crackle

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    Messages:
    815
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Melbourne
    I assume it works with the old amplifiers and supplies them with power.
    I assume compatible with old amplifiers IR reticulation

    Can you chain an old MARPA to the digial input

    KRIX are great speakers. Good Choice


    What are the GREEN Specs... how much less power does this system use over the old product. especially the AMPs on external power supplies when they are turned off.

    Same external Power supply ??

    New desktop AMP or does this stay the same ?


    When the door bell is pressed can you configure which zones it plays at.

    When you say four sounds can that be 4 group addresses for 4 doorbells

    What happens on MK1 B/W touch screens any support ?

    Charles
     
    Charlie Crackle, Nov 24, 2009
    #84
  5. Conformist

    Conformist

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Messages:
    760
    Likes Received:
    67
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    yep

    yep

    Not sure what you mean... MARPA is programming software.


    Thanks

    Not sure... good question. I'll find out

    Yes, for high temperature (but with an adapter for the new amp that comes with the power supply)

    There is a new switch-mode 24V dc power supply (lower cost) for the new amp. Standard connection for the amp and a range of plugtops for different countries (4 interchangeable).

    Same

    It uses the 'high priority broadcast' feature. This is configured at an amplifier. In order to keep backwards compatibility, it's been implemented this way. You can't say play doorbell 1 in only certain zones.

    You may be able to do something more elaborate using the same action selector and audio scenes... haven't tried this yet.

    You can select a different sound for different group addresses (well action selectors really).

    Not too sure at this stage. There is a lot that needs to be included to support MRA and there is virtually no room left in this product for feature upgrades.
     
    Conformist, Nov 25, 2009
    #85
  6. Conformist

    Charlie Crackle

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    Messages:
    815
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Melbourne

    Sorry I met the OLD MRA.


    Can you chain an old MRA to the digial input
     
    Charlie Crackle, Nov 25, 2009
    #86
  7. Conformist

    Conformist

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Messages:
    760
    Likes Received:
    67
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    The digital has not changed so I guess the answer is yes.
     
    Conformist, Nov 25, 2009
    #87
  8. Conformist

    brett_lynn

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Beaconsfield Vic
    Job Well Done....

    Looks good :)

    Just 1 Question..
    Has the cbus power supply either
    1. Been removed
    or
    2. Been made software (or even hardware) selectable...

    Would be good to know for when "Mrs Jones" wants to add MRA to her 8 year old house thats already running close (enough) to 2 amps.

    Cheers
     
    brett_lynn, Dec 16, 2009
    #88
  9. Conformist

    Newman

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    Messages:
    2,203
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    C-Bus power supply will not be included inside the new Matrix Switcher.
     
    Newman, Dec 16, 2009
    #89
  10. Conformist

    brett_lynn

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Beaconsfield Vic
    Great News Newman :)

    Now... while on the new products topic....

    any update on the Wiser / iPhone App for Cbus from Clipsal?
     
    brett_lynn, Dec 18, 2009
    #90
  11. Conformist

    Aaron

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Wales, UK
    Hi,

    on the wiring side I think it would be nice to have the modern push type connectors to speed up wiring for the power and c-bus circuits, rather than screw terminals.

    Also, perhaps some common terminals for neutral connections and earth connections associated with that dimmer/relay?
     
    Aaron, Dec 18, 2009
    #91
  12. Conformist

    brett_lynn

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Beaconsfield Vic
    Just a thought....

    Hello Engineers......

    is there any chance that Cbus Diag will run from C-gate?

    would b handy on the odd occasion when dont have a second PCI / CNI

    Cheers



    ** Sits Back and Waits Patiently **
     
    brett_lynn, Dec 18, 2009
    #92
  13. Conformist

    ashleigh Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Messages:
    2,392
    Likes Received:
    24
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    Sorry - that is not possible.

    Cgate will in time have is diagnostic abilities improved, but not to the same depth as a dedicated diagnostic tool.
     
    ashleigh, Dec 18, 2009
    #93
  14. Conformist

    brett_lynn

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Beaconsfield Vic
    hmmmm .... Ears pricked up similar to Dr. Spocks .... Woohoo
     
    brett_lynn, Dec 18, 2009
    #94
  15. Conformist

    kjayakumar

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2008
    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    0
    The rumour is that it is almost there, but keep in mind there is a set of review cycles that it goes through with Apple who are now flooded with many iphone/itouch apps for their consideration.
     
    kjayakumar, Dec 20, 2009
    #95
  16. Conformist

    brett_lynn

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2004
    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Beaconsfield Vic
    Hi KJ
    more than happy (begging), willing and able to do field testing.... ;-):D
     
    brett_lynn, Dec 20, 2009
    #96
  17. Conformist

    Mick01

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2009
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Melb
    With the new MARP coming out shortly , does anyone know if it is still limited to 4 amps per Matrix Switcher? Reason is that I have around seven areas I would like to put speakers in, so I can have the option to have one speaker on at any one time.

    thanks
     
    Mick01, Feb 2, 2010
    #97
  18. Conformist

    NickD Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2004
    Messages:
    1,420
    Likes Received:
    62
    Location:
    Adelaide
    I'm not sure what you mean by "limited to 4 amps per Matrix Switcher"... can you elaborate?

    Nick
     
    NickD, Feb 2, 2010
    #98
  19. Conformist

    Mick01

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2009
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Melb
    sorry my mistake I was looking at the clipsal catalog and it was only showing 4 amplifiers (zones) connected to the Matrix switcher. On reading the specs it shows up to 8 zones. Exactly what I am after.

    Does the late Feb release date still stand?
     
    Mick01, Feb 2, 2010
    #99
  20. Conformist

    NickD Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2004
    Messages:
    1,420
    Likes Received:
    62
    Location:
    Adelaide
    No worries.

    In actual fact you can have more than 8 amplifiers (but not more than 8 *zones*).

    Each of the 8 zones can select its own source, but each zone can have master and slave amplifiers.

    A slave amp uses the same source as the master, however it can have independent volume control.

    As for release dates - we can't comment on that here. I can tell you we're all busting our guts to get it out though!

    Nick
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 2, 2010
    NickD, Feb 2, 2010
Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments (here). After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.