Problem with 2 Key input unit

Hi guys I have a bit of a problem with one of my input units. Its a CBUS1 2 key unit about 5 years old. All its doing is sitting there with the two status indicator LEDs on. Pressing the keys has no effect on the switch nor the loads it's controlling. I configured one of the other input units to control the loads this key was meant to be controlling and as I expect the loads switch ok, but the input unit LED's stay on rather than following the load status.

I've bounced the power controlling C-BUS and physically disconnected the unit from the network without luck. The unit appears to be hung.

It started playing up when I did a network scan using C-BUS tool kit V1.1.6 which I installed yesterday. I was getting into one of my PIR's to change the sunset function time. Everything appeared to work fine. I closed toolkit and walked into the room where this switch is and I noticed the fault.

On the orginal network scan it picked up this unit, however on every scan I've tried since it doesn't see it. I even out of desperation tried to add it as a new unit without much luck.

Anyone with some more suggestions, or does it look like I have, after 5 years my first stuffed C-Bus unit?

Thanks

 

Ashley

I suggest that you set the unit up on a small sub-network consisting of a power supply, PCI and hardware network burden. This will enable you to independently test whether the unit is OK or not. It may just be incorrectly programmed.

Which specific CBusV1 unit was it? Did you re-address any units when using Toolkit?

 

It could be th evil duplicate address detection

As Newman suggests, but if toolkit doesn't find it, try an earlier SW tool, like V2 or even V1. If the unit is still not there, try (with an early tool), changing the address of all the units you see (which should be a small number). The address changing process should expose any hidden units.

If all the above fails, try disconnecting the unit and letting it cool down for 20 minutes or so before reconnecting and attempting a scan. I have had early C-Bus units in my home for 7 years, and yes, recently had a failed unit due to a transistor failure. letting the unit cool down brought it back to the network, so I was happy that it was a hardware fault (I've since replaced the unit). These things were designed to last 20 years+++, so even 5 years isn't really good enough imho

Let myself or Newman know if none of the above works. I would like to track this closely. Toolkit should not be able to cause this type of problem (even Beta versions).

Don

 

what is the date of manufacture of the unit? When you scan does it come up with the Unit Address but no other details?

 

Will give some of those tips a burl and see what happens.

Uncle Dick, not sure of the exact date of manufacture, guess it will be on the unit itself, but I brought it in Canberra around May/June 2000. Its just a plain old 2 key unit, C2000 series, not C-BUS2. I'm guessing there is no key and/or power up sequence to take the unit back to factory default, just in case the 'software' or NVRAM inside has got its knickers in a knot which is what I'm thinking the problem is?

When I do a network scan it doesn't come up with anything. In the database in tool kit I think I have 14 devices on the network, but after a scan one of the indicators on the bottom of the page just shows the number of found devices as 13/14 (I'm at work and don't have tool kit in front of me) If you click on the unit that has failed and try to save to it, the message that comes back is something along the lines of not on the network but the other units are fine.

I tried my orginal version of C-Bus software (non tool kit) and if I try and save to the unit I get a no response error. I tried adding it as a new item in both the old and new versions to no avail. It shouldn't make a difference but I use Minder as my PC/C-Bus interface.

The two things I did, appart from a network scan was change the sunset time on one of my PIR's. I will check that one first to see if I may have inadvertantly changed its address to that of the failed unit, but if that were the case wouldn't tool kit have warned of a conflict, or not allowed me to select the same address? The other thing I did was dummy add a DLT so I could have a bit of a look at the programming side of it, but then deleted it. The address I choose for that was in the 100's, which is well away from all my units which are sub 60 and I didn't try to save on the network.

Anyway will have more of a play around and see what I can come up with. Thanks for the tips.

 

Oh well played around most of last night and today and couldn't get the input unit to do anything different. Had it powered off all night with no luck. Everytime I connect it it just sits there with the two idicators on looking pretty dumb. Whilst playing around I found another slight problem, which is more software related so have posted that problem in that thread.

In the end I just went and brought a new one, luckly my local lighting shop keeps some C-Bus as stock items. So now have my first C-bus2 device!

For the CIS guys here I doubt this would be a warranty issue considering its 5 years old, but as I said it happened when I was making changes in toolkit so would you want it back to have a look at it?

Thanks all for your suggestions and advice.

 

I suspect that it might be failed transistors in the units power regulation circuit but you should return it to CIS Test and Repair Department CIS, 12 Park Terrace, Bowden, Adelaide 5007, Attn Lyn Amber/Richard King. Print off a copy of the forum thread and send it with the repair.

 

Thanks Uncledick, will return it. Will be interesting to see what the problem is with it.

 

multiple C-Bus switch failures...

Hi Ashley,

What was the outcome with your problem?

I had two units fail in exactly the same way a few weeks apart several months ago, so just bit the bullet and bought replacement units. Today I had a third unit fail and decided this all seems to be a bit on the ridiculous (and expensive) side - to be continuously replacing switches just seems plain wrong.

I'd really appreciate it if you could let me know how you got on. I will call CIS as soon as they are back on deck and see what they have to say on the issue.

Thanks,
Craig

 

Hi Ashley..

What was the final outcome of your switch problem... did you get them tested ?? I called Craig a few days ago ..he had the exact same problem and now so do I... my system too is about 7 years old.. I wonder if any techs out there can confirm (or deny) that there is a problem with these clipsal switches that are of this vintage ???

cheers

Ian

 

Sorry guys I had lost track of this thread altogether and didn't realise there were futher replies.

The upshot is I don't know. I sent the key unit back to CIS and never heard another word about it. Basicaly as it wasn't under warranty and because i brought a new one I didn't chase it up.


Anyone from CIS recall this one and find out what the fault was?

 

Well I have just lost the second of my 2 button switches. Exact same symptoms as before, purchased at the same time etc. Looks like a trip to the local to purchase a replacement. Not good after only 5 1/2 years of use. I hope my 4 button switches of the same vintage don't start going out in sympathy otherwise it will be a costly exercise.

At least with this one I wasn't making any programming changes at the time, so can confirm that is no an issue, it has just decided enough is enough.

Have also tried the tricks suggested last time to no avail.

 

Hi,

I wonder if there has been any update on this issue?

I have just had my second switch unit fail in this way. All units were purchased in mid-2000.

The first was a 2-gang unit - it is temperature intermitent. When cold the unit works fine. When the unit gets warm the LEDs come on and the unit stops working.

The second that has just failed is a 4-gang unit - it has a permanent fault. All 4 LEDS just come on hard.

Does anyone know if CIS are interested in this fault?

As mentioned earlier about 6 years of usage is not that great...

Thanks,
Tim