Neo Wireless

Hello.

A long time ago I had a lot to do with this product. I have been asked to come out of retirement to try and answer the questions here.

The first step in dealing with this problem would seem to be that all the devices should be reset to detaults. A power up from the breaker DOES NOT DO THIS.

Please read on, I will try and explain as best I can.

HOW SETUP WORKS

A side issue: Wireless units are set up using LEARN MODE.

LEARN MODE can be disabled. If learn mode is disabled, then you can't change the settings. This is good to stop the kids fiddling with it, and bad if you want to change it.

Therefore, learn mode has a time window (after a power up from the breaker) - about 30 minutes from memory. During that time, if learn mode was set to disabled, it will be enabled for that time window only.

This is therefore your get-of-of-jail-free card.

Learn mode can only be disabled using Toolkit (through a gateway), so if you have not ever done that, you don't need to worry about this issue. Likewise a clear to factory defaults will reset this, so again after that level of clear you don't need to worry about turning power off at the breaker.


HOW LEARN WORKS

If devices are joined in a network, then entering Learn on one unit will put all the devcies in the network into Learn.

You can tell by entering learn and then inspecting (by walking around) the other units to see if their indicators are blinking.

THEREFORE: If you put a unit unit learn, and find another unit that does not have blinking indicators, then the unit without the blinking indicators is not in learn and is not part of the same network.


HOW TO CLEAR A UNIT TO FACTORY DEFAULTS

STEP 1. Start Learn on a C-Bus Wireless unit by pressing both of the top two Local Control Keys and holding for 10 seconds.

YOU SEE:

• Indicators on the Local Control Keys of all C-Bus Wireless units in the network flash very quickly in an alternating pattern.
• This shows the C-Bus Wireless unit is ready to learn.
• After about 5 seconds the alternating flash pattern slows down.
• The C-Bus Wireless unit is still ready to learn.

STEP 2. Go to the unit that you want to clear. Double click any key.

YOU SEE:

• All indicators on that unit will go out, apart from the one on the key that was double-clicked.

STEP 3. Double click the same key again.

YOU SEE:

• All of the indicators on the unit will flash quickly.

STEP 4.
Option a: Oops: I don't want to clear this unit: do another double click on the same key again.
Option b: Yes I really want to clear this unit: Press and hold any key on the unit for about 1 second.

YOU SEE:

• All of the indicators will stop flashing.

RESULT:
(1) The unit has been cleared.
(2) Other units in the same network exit Learn.

NOTE THAT WHEN YOU CLEAR THE UNIT, IT HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM THE NETWORK.

Therefore: If there are multiple units in the network, and you want to clear and take them out of the network you need to repeat this process, at each unit, one at a time.


HOW FORMING A NETWORK WORKS

Networks work by the units having a "house code". This is just a random number, allocated in the factory when the unit was made. It can't be changed, and its value does not matter.

The house code allows you to have 2 or more C-Bus Wireless units in the same RF range (so they can see each other) BUT you can make separate networks. (Think apartment buildings with units that can see each other but we want them to be in completely distinct networks.)

If units share the same house code, then they are in the same network, so they can talk to each other.

(Again as a side issue, the idea of a house code is not in plain wired C-Bus, because it is not needed. Things are in the same network if the piece of wire goes to them.)

So the problem we face is: how do we get 2 units to share the same house code?

The method used, assuming we have 2 blank units (from the factory or after BOTH have been cleared):

- We put them both into learn mode
- By use of a special button sequence, ONE OF THEM (it does not matter which) pushes to the other "hey you - I want you to run on house code XXXXXX".

After that they share the house code and are in the same network. At that point, if you enter learn on one of them, they both go into learn, because they are both talking.

Now: how to grow the network beyond 2 nodes?

The same process is repeated, but order of operations is very important.

The principle is that:

- We put the new device (the one we want to join to the existing network) into Learn, and then a special operation on that unit to put it into HOUSE CODE LEARN mode, a special sub-mode that opens the unit up to accepting a house code

- We then go to the network we already have, and put it into learn

- And then (on the network we already have that we just put into learn), we use the special button sequence to push out the message (which goes to the unit that is in house code learn but not on the network yet) "HEY YO DUDES NOT ON A NETWORK... SUCK UP THIS HERE HOUSE CODE AND JOIN MY FUNKY NETWORK".

You get the idea.

Basically:
1. Put the NEW device into learn first, and then house code learn.
2. Go to the existing network, put it into learn, and then use the key sequence to push out the message saying "join this network"

This is best done to add units to a network, one at a time.

The way C-Bus Wireless works, you could have 2 brand shiny new clear devices, put them both into house code learn, and then go to your existing network and put it into learn, punch out the "join my network" message, and both of those new ones would join. But that's waaay too complicated to explain and we are trying to keep it simple.

Why keep it simple? Because you wear out a lot of shoes running from unit to unit doing these steps, it is tedious, and there is no other user interface. You need to think the process through logically and slowly and be patient. Trying to do too much in a single go will lead to confusion and swearing. (Bear in mind, things like Bluetooth were US$100 for a chipset the size of a matchbox when C-Bus wireless was created, and the smartphone had not been invented, so other clever means of UI setup were not around, not viable, etc etc).


SO THE STEPS TO FORM A NETWORK FROM 2 UNITS ARE:

STEP 1. Pick a C-Bus Wireless unit. We call this the SLAVE UNIT. This is the one you will be joining to the network. It will accept the house code. Start Learn by pressing both of the top two Local Control Keys, and hold them for 10 seconds.

YOU SEE:

• Indicators on the Slave C-Bus Wireless unit Local Control Keys flash very quickly in an alternating pattern.
• This shows the C-Bus Wireless unit is ready to be put into a network.

STEP 2. At the same SLAVE UNIT, AND WITHIN 5 seconds, use the key sequence that allows this unit to accept a house code - ie go into house code learn mode.
- This is: Press and hold both the top 2 Local Control keys and hold for 2 seconds. (You need to see the indicators... on a Saturn this can be difficult, try and move your fingers a bit to the side).

YOU SEE:

• Indicators on the Slave C-Bus Wireless Slave Device will change so they all slowly flash on and off together.
• This shows the Slave C-Bus Wireless unit is ready to learn a network.

STEP 3. Now go to some other unit.
Option a. If you don't already have a network this can be any other unit you like. We call this the NETWORK MASTER UNIT..
Option b. If you already have a network, go to one of the units already formed into a network. It does not matter which one, though physically closer to your new unit is probably better.

THEN: At this unit, put it into Learn (as usual, press and hold the top 2 buttons until the crazy blink starts, which shows it is in learn)

NOTICE: at this point you have NOT transferred the house code.

STEP 4. On the NETWORK MASTER UNIT that you should now still be standing in front of: Press and hold one of the top two Local Control Keys, and while still holding this key, double-click the other of the top two Local Control Keys. Then release both keys.

YOU SEE:

• Indicators on the C-Bus Wireless Network Master unit flash together very quickly for about a second.
• Indicators on the C-Bus Wireless Slave unit(s) flash together very quickly for about a second.
• All affected units exit the Learn setting, and all indicators are off.

At this point you have joined 2 units into a network, or if you already had a network, you just added a unit to that network.

AFTER THAT YOU STILL NEED TO GO BACK INTO LEARN TO SET UP GROUPS AND SCENES.


TIMEOUTS

The above is all very nice, but there are timeouts. Units don't stay in learn, or house code learn, forever.

The SLAVE UNIT that you walked away from and left in house code learn mode... you have 3 minutes. After that - that slave unit will exit learn mode by itself.

So don't dawdle.

Likewise, Learn mode has timeouts (I don't recall what they are).


NEXT UP: LINKING A GATEWAY

You need an existing C-Bus Wireless network (unless linking a single unit to a gateway).

The process is very similar to joining a slave to a C-Bus Wireless network, except the gateway is placed into house code learn mode.

IT IS MUCH LESS CONFUSING IF YOU FORM THE WIRELESS NETWORK AND THEN JOIN THE GATEWAY TO IT.

(Trying to set up a network with one unit, join gateway, then join other units, is possible but very easy to get confused. Form the wireless units into a network first, and then join the gateway to the wireless network.)

STEP 1. Press and release the LEARN button on the bottom of the Gateway.

YOU SEE:

• The LEARN indicator on the Gateway flashes slowly.

STEP 2. Choose any C-Bus Wireless unit in the existing C-Bus Wireless network.

STEP 3. Start Learn on the C-Bus Wireless unit that you chose: Press both of the top two Local Control Keys and hold them for 10 seconds.

YOU SEE:

• Indicators on all of the C-Bus Wireless units Local Control Keys flash very quickly in an alternating pattern.
• This shows the C-Bus Wireless units have entered the Learn mode.
• After about 5 seconds the alternating flash pattern slows down - this is normal.

STEP 4. At that C-Bus Wireless unit that you put into learn: Transmit the house code. Do this by
- Press and hold one of the top two Local Control Keys, and while still holding this key, double-click the other of the top two Local Control Keys. Then release both keys.

YOU SEE:

• Indicators on the C-Bus Wireless units flash together very quickly for about a second.
• The LEARN Indicator on the Gateway flashes very quickly for about a second.
• All affected units exit the Learn setting, and all indicators go off, including the gateway.

RESULT: The gateway is now joined to the wireless network.

------------------------------

I hope all the above is of some use and help.

I have had C-Bus wireless running in parts of my house, untouched and trouble free for something like 15 years. It's a long time since I went through the learn processes.

To work out the above steps I found some documentation that was done during the original development: Field trial guide written in the Dept of Geeks, and used long before the products were publicly released, that documentation got polished up quite a lot after that.

Also you may see some of the steps above are in different orders to your documentation. My steps above are not the fast efficient steps to join lots of units all at once. My steps are the simple steps that you can repeat over and over, should work every time, and should be simple with less worry about "fast, clever, efficient but confusing".

 

Hello BigDave

The fact the units give the "happy dance" blink pattern after power up is a good sign. It means the firmware is in there and running.

Everything was done for a reason. Things like the happy dance at power up consumes code, is a pain to write the code, needs to be tested and so on. But it is there because it tells you something. It tells you that after power up the code is running and the unit is not stone dead.

So the big challenge you face is is:
- How to get it into Learn
- How to get the outputs unstuck

Some thoughts here. Bear in mind its a decade ago since I "retired" from Clipsal, so the memory has faded a touch.

Anyhow, obvious things to consider.

1. Is the unit the right way up?

When oriented vertically (so the "long" side is vertical), you have 2 ways to do it. The unit is symmetric. We think of these as having a right way up and an upside-side down, which great if you are in the know, From memory the label on the back should have the writing the right way up in order for it to be considered "right way up".

This one might be a bit patronising, but it's pretty easy to have it upside down, and so you end up pushing the button pair at the opposing end, which won't do a lot.

In you are of a Victorian persuasion where most switches are mounted "side on" - ie the long side is horizontal, then the perception of "top 2 buttons" is different again, and they will be the leftmost or rightmost pair.

Basically, use the label at the back to get the orientation of "top" correct.

It could be as simple as this... or not.

2. The stuck outputs might be due to load type.

The C-Bus Wireless dimmers had a min load of abot 25W incandescent, and are unlikely to work all that well on a modern LED load unless theres a fair bit of it.

The C-Bus Wireless relays had a min load of I can't remember what - they are fine on incandescents, floodlights, and similar. Also fluros with a nice big PFC cap in. Again modern LED loads may cause them a struggle.

So make sure you simplify as much as you can, use incandescent loads only for both, and make sure they are both over 40W. This way you remove load type as a complicating factor.

This may or may not help.

----------------------------------------------------------------

I'm a bit concerned by your statement that one of the devices had learn disabled by use of toolkit at some time.

There were 2 magical setting in toolkit, as I recall. These were to disable learn, and to enable / disable security & encryption.

So a bigger layer of complication in C-Bus Wireless is that communications over the air was also encrypted, but this was optional. It is possible to turn encryption off on a network, and doing so needs to be done rather carefully.

It is a remote possibility this was also done, and off the top of my head I don't recall if that setting survives the clear function, or not. Lets hope it is cleared. It certainly should have been.

Over the next couple of days, I'll see if there is anything else I remember.

 

@ashleigh... this is (just one of the reasons) why we miss you. Thanks.

@Bigdave... if the minimum load is the problem your sparky should be able to get you a thing called a load correction device... amongst other things these are designed to provide sufficient power to 2-wire devices such as C-Bus wireless, when used with low-power loads. Clipsal sell one called a 31LCDA, but I'm pretty sure ashleigh's own company also makes one under the Diginet brand, so in this case I suggest you try those instead.

Nick