eDLT Proximity Sensing

Discussion in 'C-Bus Wired Hardware' started by Roti, Apr 21, 2014.

  1. Roti

    Roti

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    Hi.

    I've been trying out a couple of the new eDLTs.

    My wife sleeps badly with any sort of light in the room, so I set the unit at the bedroom entry to switch to Standby just showing a clock at 1% brightness.

    The strange thing is the switch location seems to be possessed! The switch wakes up (ie to normal brightness showing page 1, as it normally would with proximity trigger) irregularly through most of the night, sometimes more than every minute.

    I thought maybe there was something wrong with the switch, so I transferred the programming to another switch, which behaved exactly the same (whether set to the same address or a different address). I put another switch with the same programming in the next wall at 90 degrees, within 2 metres, and it works fine.

    I've been pulling my hair our trying to find out what is triggering it - ruled out curtains, moved wifi access points, any electronic devices in line of sight. There are a couple of coax and cat5 cables running a few feet away in the wall, but they are not connected to anything at either end, so presume they can't be emitting any weird RF signal. Can't imagine NSA/ASIO are interested in bugging me, and the house is new, so no ghosts likely !

    Sometimes, there will be a night where it seems to go quiet and works completely normally. The next night it starts again.

    I set the standby time to five seconds, and it just emphasises how often the switch proximity sensor is getting triggered - turn on and off every few seconds at times. I just lie in bed and watch it waking up and going back into standby every few minutes, or sometimes even every few seconds.

    Anyone got any ideas about either:
    1) What could be triggering it, that I have not thought of ?
    2) How to try shielding it from interference ?

    Thanks.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2014
    Roti, Apr 21, 2014
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  2. Roti

    daniel C-Busser Moderator

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    Have you had a chance to run this past Tech Support?

    IANA hardware person, but can you cover up the sensor? It might confirm if there's a physical trigger or if it's ghosts in the machine, so to speak.
     
    daniel, Apr 22, 2014
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  3. Roti

    leeandj

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    Bump...

    Was this situation ever resolved? I have recently taken delivery of seven eDLTs and three of them exhibit this behavior.

    Thanks,
    Lee.
     
    leeandj, Nov 17, 2014
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  4. Roti

    Roti

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    Hi.

    For what it's worth, I never managed to fix it.

    I eventually gave up and just disabled proximity sensing for the affected switch location. Now you just press a button to wake it up.

    I've noticed that another switch in the house behaves the same way, but as it's in a location where nobody would really notice or care, I've just ignored it.

    Good luck. I'd like to hear if you eventually figure it out.
     
    Roti, Nov 24, 2014
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  5. Roti

    leeandj

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    Thanks for the update Roti. I am planning to test a number of different situations to see if I can narrow it down. I will repost when done.

    Cheers, Lee.
     
    leeandj, Nov 26, 2014
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  6. Roti

    robsgt4

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    How did you go with the testing Lee, I was going to get one at least but i might just stick with the DLT's for now.
     
    robsgt4, Jan 23, 2015
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  7. Roti

    rhamer

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    I have a client that is having this exact same issue in their bedroom, and is getting very grumpy about it.

    Is there a known resolution to this?

    Failing that, can CIS describe the detecting technology/mechanism so I can try and figure out what might be waking it up.

    I'm wondering if a heating duct might be blowing on it or something like that.

    Rohan
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 8, 2017
    rhamer, Jun 8, 2017
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  8. Roti

    rhamer

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    Found another thread that says firmware 1.4 fixes the problem.

    I'll try that and see what happens.

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Jun 8, 2017
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  9. Roti

    rhamer

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    Ok, upgrading to v1.4 did not fix the problem.

    One interesting point was when the eDLT was hanging on its wires and pointing at the ground, it seemed to behave. Once it was back on the wall it would only stay dark for a few seconds before waking up.

    There is a PIR on the opposite wall and I wonder if this is what is causing the issue?

    Knowing more about the detection method would help us figure it out.

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Jun 14, 2017
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  10. Roti

    ashleigh Moderator

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    It uses capacitive proximity detection.

    I doubt a PIR opposite would have anything to do with the behaviour. Far more likely to be parasitic capacitance between the sensing device and the wall. That would be why you see a difference between mounted / not mounted.

    What kind of wall material. I bet that plasterboard behaves different to solid brick / concrete / stone.

    I'm not sure this helps though as I doubt there is a lot you can do to change parasitic capacitance.
     
    ashleigh, Jun 14, 2017
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  11. Roti

    rhamer

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    Thanks Ashleigh.

    I'm one step removed from the physical work, so I'll have to check with the installer about the wall composition. The house is brand new, so I'm assuming it's normal gyprock, but I'll ask.

    However I have no idea what to do about it. I could try a mounting block off the wall, and checking for other wiring running behind it, to prove the issue.

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Jun 14, 2017
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  12. Roti

    Damaxx

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    Random thought - one my edlt units that has this issue is on an exterior wall, so it has sisalation behind the switch. Could that be causing issue? Is the switch thats playing up in a similar scenario rhamer?
     
    Damaxx, Jun 14, 2017
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  13. Roti

    rhamer

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    Good thought.
    I don't know about the sisalation, but I will find out.

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Jun 14, 2017
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  14. Roti

    Matthew

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    That would sort of make sense
    sisalation that i've seen is a foil on a flexible (insulating) substrate.
    That is essentially what a capacitor is made of, the difference being it is all rolled up together.
    Looking forward to hearing the site report.
     
    Matthew, Jun 15, 2017
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  15. Roti

    Damaxx

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    It was only when Ashleigh stated it was capacitive sensing that it occurred to me. I assumed it was infrared prox. sensing so now I just hope that I am onto something!

    My last house had the exact same issue with a switch installed at the backdoor- http://www.cbusforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=51496&postcount=2
    So you can imagine my confusion when I installed a new edlt in my new house at the back door... and the "auto on function/bug" showed up again - and 6 other units in the new place didnt!?!
    (Even changed the TagName to something other than 'Backdoor' to try and fix the fault.... it was the only thing that seemed to be common between the two houses :D ) Only thing that I can think other than that is they are both installed on external walls and no other edlt's were.
     
    Damaxx, Jun 15, 2017
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  16. Roti

    rhamer

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    Well in our case it is a bog standard Gyprock internal wall with nothing unusual behind the switch.
    In fact the room next door is constructed exactly the same and does not seem to have the issue. (and yes we have changed the switches with the same result).

    Has anybody had this issue and actually managed to fix it? and if so how.

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Jun 19, 2017
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  17. Roti

    fleetz

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    The last project I did has 2 eDLT out of 23 that are "possessed".

    Relocated the 2 units to other locations and they do the same thing, the displays come on random and go off as expected. I doubt in these particular cases that building material are the cause. The two sites that were doing this random display on no longer do it and the issue follows the two units.

    I have a post on this here from a couple of years ago. Should have got these back to Clipsal back then, they are a tick over two years old now and out of warranty. It wasn't until I saw this thread that triggered my aging memor.
     
    fleetz, Aug 24, 2017
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  18. Roti

    rhamer

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    I never got this resolved.
    We ended up turning off the feature.
    Lesser of 2 evils.

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Aug 25, 2017
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  19. Roti

    eha002

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    Did you ever find a solution to this?
    I've tried upgrading firmware to 1.5 and still randomly switching on every 30 seconds to a minute.

    It's in a shitty spot, has intercom right above, an aluminum sliding door track 100mm to the right and a square set hamper that an alloy swing door hinges through ( hinge is on the other side)
     
    eha002, Apr 10, 2019
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  20. Roti

    Damaxx

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    No I didn't. I ended up just disabling the function on two of the eDLTs that were playing up.
     
    Damaxx, Apr 10, 2019
    #20
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