Dynamic button DLT function

Hi Richo,

Glad it wasn't just me! I have order 10 sets of blue capes, red underwear (to be worn externally) and large yellow S's and should be there for the engineering team on Monday!

No sure if I should have started another thread in the Toolkit section anyway it seems appropriate to bang it in here.

I have read Daniel's Tutorial on DLT 4/11/04 and Marks's 29/3/06 as well as the DLT download from the intermediate C-Bus training section (refers to 2004) all material would have been written with different firmware and Toolkit versions.

All good stuff and relavent at the time however there appears to be no reference document that incorporates all the functionality, changes and indeed some ommisions from the written material. Is there now a reference manual on the DLT's and how to label the DLT using the DLT Tool from within Toolkit?

Any new reference document I believe should include
- How to add a label to a DLT?
- How to edit and or delete a label that already exists on a DLT?
- How to label a scene that has been assigned to a DLT?
- Action Selectors and how they are used in DLT's?
- List the known limitations and work arounds using the DLT Tool?
- How to identify which DLT unit you are addressing and changing test on?
- Expalin what the trigger control and trigger groups do and how to use them?
- What is Application 0 and what does it do?
- What to do and how to handle Unused buttons?
- Variants how and where to use them?

I have probably forgotten some but the jist of what I am suggesting is there. If you spend a few hours there are posts on the forum that cover most or all of the above however unless you have grown up with the evolution of Toolkit and DLT's you don't have a clus as to the relavence of the information in the post. It would be nice to have it contained in an up to reference especially given that CIS recognise that there are know issues, limiations and work arounds. This I feel is the minimum the CIS are obligated to do whilst the superman outfits are being slipped on.

I hope that I speak for a few people on the forum who are struggling to make sense of the DLT labeling. If you have grown with the process it probably isn't an issue if you have not then is as previously describe, respectfully a PITA.

I know that the evoultion of product and firmware sometimes doesn't necessary keep track with the documention. Just thought I would bring it to your attention.

My apologies in advance if a comprehensive up to date refernece document exists that I am not aware off.

Regards,

Fleetz

 

Hi Ashleigh,

Sounds like a few more Superman outfits are required!

Please take my comments as constructive. I am well aware how it works in developing technology. When products are developed you get to close and perhaps not as objective to what supports the product. Been there done that so I do understand, it isn't until you get revertives such as on the forum and customers in the field that these things bubble to the surface.

The fact that the CIS team open themselves to this forum and are reactive and supportive within the constraints of available resources is a quality not found often in the industry.

Just to point out how things can disconnect over time. I went in to the Toolkit online help and selected "Programming the DLT Labels" having done a DLT search......the following is the current description.

There will be six scenes, each of which will have a DLT input key programmed to activate a given scene. Each of these DLT keys have labels which can be programmed using the action selectors associated with each of the scenes/keys. (What is the input unit....not the 5085DL as it has 8 scenes)

> Assigning an action selector to each of the scenes What i am wanting to do)

1. Open the unit configuration dialog box of a DLT in the Units on Network window. (No problem)
2. For each of the seven scenes:(Now there are 7 scenes not 6 as previously stated?)

a. Click on the Programming Details button to the right of the Function drop down list on the top portion of the configuration dialog box. The Define a Scene Key dialog box appears. In the All Keys section Where exactly is All Keys on the 5085DL? No label exist named that), the Absolute_TriggerAbsolute Trigger??? is this correct, never heard of an Absolute Trigger nor can I find it?) application group appears. This group applies to all of the scenes.

b. Select or create action selectors which correspond to the input source that the scene will activate. For example, Scene 1 controls the activation of audio input local to the network. For this scene, select or create an action selector called: Local. On the 5085DL the action selector is greyed out....at this point I am lost with the 5085DL!)


c. Save the results by clicking the OK button. This returns you back to the unit configuration dialog box.

3. When you have completed this configuration task, click the Apply button in the unit configuration dialog box.

4. Quit the dialog box by using the Cancel button.

Topics in the section Programming absolute source controlAbsolute source level progressionConfiguring the DLT unit for scenesDefining the audio sources for absolute audio control Do I assume that this refers to C-Bus audio input unit? If so which one covers the 5085DL?

This is just an example of how products can change and simple folk like me get lost in the woods! You and no doubt the CIS team will read this and say this means that and this is that which is what happens when you grow up with the product. Hope this better explains some of the frustration.

Of course the DLT labeling interface is the thing that needs the tickle up but that is in the queue, if the labeling interface was slick then a lot of the documentation requirements diminish but of course doesn't dissappear ......

Thanks for the lend of the CIS team ears!

Regards,

Fleetz

 

Ok so now I have worked out how to change lables on the DLT using c-gate. How do I do it using a PAC?

 

DLT change via Cgate

Hi filpee

you said you ware able to change the DLT label via cgate

can you please share with us the commands you use, as I would like to try
this also.

cheers
Arni

 

Hi Ashleigh,

Has any thing happen with an updated tutorial?

The DLT labelling is still plaguing me. I have tried your well described how to from your previous post dated 03 Mar 07 01:33 PM it all makes sense but when I step through it nothing changes on the DLT unit.

I have got on with other things on my project and thought I would come back to it with a new look at the issue. It doesn't matter if your suggested way of doing or through the Network hightlighted way is it just not happening. I have tried another new DLT unit same.

I am running 1.6.0 there are no issues posted on the 1.6.1 relating to this issue so I don't believe this is an issue.

I have been able to get some labels in a few weeks back but if you change the label from within the 'DLT Label' section and send to network and database....no changes made. Don't ask how I got the labels in a few weeks back because I couldn't tell you! I followed instructions, suggestions and tried a bunch of variations to see how to get labels in sometimes I would get labels in then repeated that process and no go.

I know I have said it before but the DLT interface is a shocker, the documention sparce at best.

Regards,

Fleetz

 

I had some issues just the other day trying to update the labels. Pretty sure that I pressed the 'Set Default' button first, saved to database and Network then i edited the labels saving to database & network again.

 

How within the DLT Labeling tool does one delete the groups that have been deleted? That is groups that still appear in the DLT labelling tool that have had the groups deleted in Toolkit.

I am trying to recover from this lock out mode I appear to be in. I have deleted the group assignment that I had programmed into the DLT keypads. I have cleared the labels from the DLT keypad and reset the DLT keypad unit. I have deleted all groups in the output units.

I open the DLT labelling tool from the Network application pane, the some remenence of the groups still exist and there appears no way of deleting them.

I had while I was trying to make sense as to what was happening enable another language (English Australian) which I have since removed. The remenence of groups might be from the second language.

I am now back to ground zero. Programmed groups back into a output unit these assigned a button to a group and function, save to the database. I then from the Network Pane open DLT and these groups are still there. I have deleted the groups from within 'Application' pane but they still appear as a group. I can now label a button!!!!!!!!

How do you delete non existing groups that still appear in the DLT labelling tool? These phantom groups claim the group that they were originally assinged.

Whilst I have made progress it has come at a price. Going back to ground zero not to mention hours of fluffing around! I now have one label on one button! But I still have some ghost in the system.

I suspect I will have to start a new project to get theses phantoms out of my project.

Cheers,

Fleetz

 

Tech Support...

Hi fleetz,

Can i suggest you try having a chat to tech support? It's what they're there for...

http://www2.clipsal.com/cis/technical/technical_support

Cheers,
Mark.

 

Hi Mark,

You make a good point.

I see documenting the issue here gives the senior guru's at CIS a better insight to issue. I suppose in my situation I am not so much looking for an instant work around, cludge the issue more to feedback what I am experiencing and to highlight the need for along term corrective action.

I have used tech support once or twice and they have been very good. (Not about this issue)

I hope that by posting here it will assist CIS to build a better mouse trap when they do get around to rewriting the DLT labelling part of toolbox. Also to reinforce the deeper you go the documention well at least what I have found is pretty thin.

CIS are aware of the issues, if people like myself document their findings, frustraions and experiences it may assist the CIS team to integrate the DLT to how the market would like to see.

Regards,

Fleetz

 

Any ideas or suggestions as to how delete labels that don't exist any more from the DLT labelling tool....see my earlier post above.

Cheers,

Fleetz