Dlt labels and functions

I have been called to look into a DLT after the painters removed it from a wall. When I arrived I found one of the + wires broken off and all labels back to defaults. Also the buttons are not doing the right operations. Eg button 1 is lights on. Button 2 lights off etc. I also have a shutter relay from buttons 7 and 8 for blinds up and down these are working back to front and would not drive partially open or closed!!

 

Umm.. Good story.. :-/

 

Hi Michael,

Certainly sounds like the DLT config has been lost/erased/corrupted. From your question I'm guessing someone else configured the site?

I need to ask, have you worked with C-Bus much before? It wouldn't normally be a big issue to get the DLT back up re-configured and running though it definitely will be much quicker and easier (and loads cheaper for the client) for the original C-Bus programmer to do it. If you haven't done much with C-Bus before, you will need to learn the C-Bus programming procedures to be able to do it yourself. This will add a large amount of time to the job.

What you need to do is briefly outlined below.

Do you know if it was previously programmed with Toolkit (most likely), or using the 'Learn Mode'(least likely)? Ask the client if the labels used to say anything special like 'Lounge' and if they did, it was programmed in Toolkit.

If it was done with 'Learn Mode', you will probably want to set it up again using that. For details on how to do this, see http://www2.clipsal.com/cis/__data/page/428/DLT Rectangular Series Users Guide2.pdf

However as noted, most DLTs would have been programmed using C-Bus Toolkit software and so ask your client if he has the PC loaded with Toolkit used to configured the network, or whether the initial installation contractor has it.

If you have the install PC, it was likely connected to C-Bus via either 1. Ethernet (wired or WIFI) using a C-Bus network interface called a CNI (or a Clipsal Wiser with a CNI) or alternatively via 2. a USB or RS-232 Serial cable to a C-Bus serial interface called a PCI. Ask the client or look at the switchboard for a C-Bus 'Network Interface' or C-Bus 'PC interface'.

If you don't have the original configuration PC your job is very much more complex for you. You will need to call the original contractor and ask for a copy of an up to date 'C-Bus Toolkit project file' for the site. This is a file with all the project module info/config details and the group address info in it for the site, ending in .XML in the 'tag' directory under C-Gate(or cgate2) directory under C:\Clipsal on their hard drive. If they can email this to you and you load the Toolkit software on your PC, put the .XML into your 'C:\clipsal\c-gate(2)\tag' directory. The Toolkit software is freely downloadable here http://www2.clipsal.com/cis/technical/downloads

From here, with the right C-Bus network attachment, you should be able to connect to the C-Bus network, update the project file, find the CNI/PCI, scan the network, find the original DLT's configuration settings and copy them from the database copy back to the on network device.

I need to point out the large number of the steps involved here, though each not really hard in itself. It probably represents at least 1.5-2 days worth of C-Bus training to cover off what you are trying to do to this point, with DLT labels and different button mode configs on top, so it's not really simple.

Whilst the original contractor would be able to reprogram it in literally minutes using the original laptop and project file, it might take you several hours at the very least to get up to speed and set up the required software to be able to do it.

Its up to you (and I guess your client's potentially misguided willingness to pay you to do it) to decide how much time can be spent learning the C-Bus system. Before even trying, see http://www.noushouse.com.au/store/cmspage.php?page_id=29 to give yourself some more basic background C-Bus knowledge.

With the right PC with the up-to-date project file, rectification would take literally a few minutes. From scratch without any/very limited previous C-Bus knowledge, write off a day (at least).

My recommendation is to get a properly trained C-Bus person in there to fix it with you and you can learn something off them. I don't like to dissuade people from learning new things, but in this case it will be obvious to your client within 15mins if you don't know what you are doing, impacting your future work from him/her and damaging your local reputation. Best not to put yourself in that position unless all other options are exhausted.

Best Regards,

Brad

 

Hi thanks for the detailed explanation.

I am currently getting trained up in cbus. I have completed the basic course, soon to complete the touch screen course and finally will be completing the DALI Gateway course. I am familiar with using toolkit. but im not too familiar with gateway yet. (is their much difference?) My current situation is that i conduct maintenance on several buildings within a university. i will contact the contractor who installed the system to provide me with a database so i can restore operation as quick as possible.


cheers again.


michael

 

Hi Michael,

Based on your noted C-Bus basic training, I apologise if I un-intentionally sounded patronising in my previous mail. I obviously mis-interpreted your original question as the wording led me to surmise that you didn't know:
1. How to check certain group addresses were properly attached to certain buttons on the DLT
and
2. that a button could have different functions assigned to it (eg the Blinds button problem, of which the button key funtions are probably on/off or something similar).

Both of these C-Bus concepts being Group address setting and key functions as well as C-Bus network design and opration are very well covered in the 'C-Bus Basic' course and workbook material, leading me to assess your skill level as being less.

Let's get on with the problem!!

From my original post, you are still of course going to take longer to get it back running than the contractor with the original project file and configuration PC as you have to 'build' a configuration system and obtain the C-Bus project 'tag' file.

If you are now tasked with maintaining this site then it makes complete sense for you to get properly set up to do this configuration in future. You can also prepare in your office prior to going onsite. Using the link provided you will be able to load a new copy of Toolkit on to your laptop (or update you training copy to the latest version), put a copy of the XML file obtained from the original installer into the right directory on your hard drive and update the project file to the latest version of Toolkit ready to take onsite to let you configure the DLT.

Onsite you are obviously aware how to attach to the C-Bus network and I think it will be easiest for you to after a C-Bus network scan, to just copy back the original 'database window' settings for the DLT back to it rather than re-creating them. If you are interested to, go into the module on the network prior to updating it to take a look, it will likely show you group addresses and key functions that were not originally set in the device ie possibly became corrupted. If this is the case, this will explain why the buttons were not working as anticipated. If it does look correct from a group address and key function perspective when you look at it from Toolkit, the DLT may have been rendered faulty due to the painter's damage and should be replaced, though warranty does not usually cover that sort of damage.

If you reconfig it and it still doesn't work as anticpated even though the module 'looks right' in the config window, then try using the 'Reset Unit' function in the opened 'module' window. This will reset the DLT back to factory defaults and change it back to address 255 ready to be reconfigured like a 'brand new' from box unit.

Good Luck,

Brad