Dimming LED globes.

Has anyone had any success dimming LED globes? Im talking about a normal E27 or bayonet type globe, not a downlight with driver.
I did a job last year where i used a dimmable LED globe on a universal dimmer which subsequently cooked the dimmer. When i contacted Clipsal about it they told me that only LED fittings with drivers can be used on a Universal dimmer. I had another discussion with them today to clarify and its not just the Universals that this applies to but the leading edge dimmers as well.
So if a client has a shiny new pendant with LED globes in it, they are basically screwed for dimming with C-bus!
Anyone have any suggestions on how to get around this (not Dali) or have used a LED globe that works?

 

LED phase dimming is problematic in general.
Not just for CBus dimmers and also for LED's with separate power supplies.

If Clipsal has told you not to use an LED bulb on a dimmer at all.
Then it is hard to make any case that you should do it for a customer.
No matter what anyone here says they have working.

Did you speak to a local rep or CIS tech support?
I'd ask CIS directly to be sure.

There are obvious solutions which will save a lot of headaches for you and the customer.

Consider if you really need dimming on the LED fitting because using a relay channel will make the whole lamp selection problem go away.
Just say you did find a LED lamp which can dim OK.
Is the customer going to know to replace it with the same or is that lamp even going to be available in two years time?
Is it going to require additional parts like 31LCDA?
It's a convoluted solution to a problem which really is just better avoided.
In your own home sure have a play and see what works but for a customer this is not a practical thing to do.

Maybe in some rooms it is possible to stage the brightness by using relay channels to turn off some of the lamps?

Look at some of the energy saving halogen bulbs.
They are cheap and they are going to work beautifully on every CBus or other dimmer.
Do the energy cost sums, I don't think they are going to be terrible.
That is what I would use in an expensive pendant or chandelier which was required to be dimmed.

 

For future reference how many LED bulbs did you have on the universal dimmer channel which blew and which LED bulb?

 

No Rules

There are no definite answers.
Phase cut dimmers (leading or trailing) were designed for other technologies, not LED.
So if you want to know for sure you have to test / try.
I have found the Osram Dimmable lamps to work the most reliably on the C-Bus leading edge dimmers.

 

Hi Mathew
I'm sure Osram will not guarantee any of their dimmable LED bulbs will work on CBus dimmers.
Some of their products have specs for dimmers and none of them include CBus dimmers.
It's an option you just could not recommend for CBus dimmers in a business environment.

 

How many xxx bulbs per channel are you going to say is OK.
It's a fools errand to even try without specs from the manufacturer.
I just would not do that to a customer for their sake and mine.

 

DarylMC, i agree with you that using relays instead of dimmers would solve the problem-today and in the future. Unfortunately, it seems rather silly-and embarrassing- telling someone that their expensive lighting control system can't do what a $50 wall dimmer can (and i have done it successfully plenty of times). I spoke to CIS tech support about it and reading between the lines it would seem that this problem has been spoken about plenty of times before.
Using halogen globes could work but probably not in this case. There are 30 globes in this particular fitting and i would have to find 20 watt or less large, fancy round halogens to come in under the universals max current-might be doable though.
The dimmer that blew had 4 globes (4 x single pendants) on it. From memory, they were 10 watts each but i cannot remember what brand.

 

It's preferable to tell the customer the fitting is unsuitable than to say it is when the manufacturer is telling you it is not.
Or find some way around it.
Maybe some rewiring and multiple channels.

I doubt there is a reputable manufacturer on the planet who can supply a 30 x E27 LED bulb array and dimmer mech to suit.