C-Bus sensors to trigger NESS M1

Discussion in 'Homesafe & Security Access & Control' started by Jaden66, Jul 1, 2020.

  1. Jaden66

    Jaden66

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    Hi,

    I am setting up my C-Bus for my new home. I also have a NESS M1 Gold security system. The question is......

    Can I use the sensors on my C-Bus system to trigger an alarm state for that area? I have been playing around with the 'Lights' section on the NESS but believe that is only to control lights. So when I have the system in an 'ARMED' state it will look at any of the many sensors I have to trigger movement within the alarm panel.

    I have the C-Bus interface board and can see it and have imported the C-Bus xml file from Toolkit

    Thanks
     
    Jaden66, Jul 1, 2020
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  2. Jaden66

    Ashley

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    You can do this but it's a bit convoluted. You can't trigger an alarm directly from rules, so you have to wire an output back to a zone input. You can then pulse that output to trigger the alarm.

    Just set the sensor up on a lighting group then create a rule like:

    WHENEVER Movement Front [68 (E4)] IS TURNED ON
    AND AREA 1 (Area 1) ARM STATE = ARMED
    THEN TURN Output 013 (Out 13) ON FOR 2 SECS

    Where 'Movement Front' is your sensor ga, and Output 13 is connected back to a spare zone input.

    But honestly, just install M1 sensors. They are cheap and are designed to detect intruders without false alarms.
     
    Ashley, Jul 1, 2020
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  3. Jaden66

    Jaden66

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    Thanks Ashley I was fearing that! I had a rule similar to what you have but not the last line. I have the sensor in lighting group as well. The C-Bus sensors do have a sensitivity control and seem to have more adjustment in the C-Bus world, plus they look nicer recessed into the ceiling and have a secondary trigger function (which I may have the wrong idea about!). One of the main reasons on me going with the NESS is that it said two way communications with the C-Bus protocol, seems one way! Hopefully a future update will allow the NESS C-Bus module to take triggers from these sensors. I just don't want to have the M1 sensors on the walls but may have to look at this option for the time being until Clipsal or NESS work it out.
     
    Jaden66, Jul 1, 2020
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  4. Jaden66

    Ashley

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    Why do you think it is one way? The M1 can both send and receive commands from Cbus.

    While it may appear that Cbus and M1 sensors are interchangeable they are actually quite different in design. Cbus sensors are occupancy sensors . They are designed to work when the house is occupied. Security sensors are just the opposite. They are designed to work when the house is unoccupied. Both have been optimised for their own function. While I have no relationship with Ness, I can confidently say that the M1 will never treat Cbus sensors as alarm sensors.

    Are you aware that Ness also sell 360deg ceiling sensors for the M1?

    And before you go the other way and try using M1 sensors to trigger Cbus groups, this is seriously discouraged as M1 sensor trigger frequently and can easily flood a Cbus network. Although there are ways around this :)
     
    Ashley, Jul 2, 2020
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  5. Jaden66

    Jaden66

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    The way I see it is that when a C-Bus sensor is triggered by movement then that sends a trigger to the Dimmer/relay module, why not also use this trigger to trigger the M1 unit. The C-Bus/NESS interface must be able to decipher these triggers being on the C-Bus network and relay them to the M1?

    Exactly so both work the same way. Someone (burglar) is on the house so therefore it is 'occupied'. If I am in the house it is 'occupied' Both sensors detect movement. If a rules states that when the system is 'armed' and it gets one of these sensors triggered then alarm.

    I do have some M1 sensors and will install them so all good. I know they are purpose built, I just wanted to use existing hardware.

    I appreciate the feedback and happy to be corrected if my logic is wrong :)
     
    Jaden66, Jul 2, 2020
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  6. Jaden66

    Jaden66

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    The drawback is if the house looses power then so does the C-Bus sensor whereas the M1 sensor will be battery backed up!
     
    Jaden66, Jul 2, 2020
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  7. Jaden66

    Ashley

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    But it does trigger the M1 unit. That's why you can use it in a rule. You seem to be saying why doesn't it trigger a zone alarm, but then the M1 would have to know it's an alarm sensor, and even if it did that the M1 would immediately loose it's UL listing as the sensor has no tamper warning or power backup.

    But it still lets you do it as described above if you really want to.
     
    Ashley, Jul 2, 2020
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  8. Jaden66

    Jaden66

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    Ok Ashley thanks. I will use the M1 sensors. The battery backup is a big thing to foil those waskuly wobbers!
     
    Jaden66, Jul 2, 2020
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  9. Jaden66

    Ashley

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    Ashley, Jul 2, 2020
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