C-Bus over fibre

Discussion in 'C-Bus Wired Hardware' started by znelbok, Apr 27, 2008.

  1. znelbok

    znelbok

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    I am a little confused here, previously it was stated that two CNI's would not work together as a Ethernet bridge. If I understand you correctly, you seem to be saying that it is possible.

    Can you expand on your statement a little more - have you got experience with two CNI's used as a bridge?

    I have a seconds CNI on the way to test this theory out - are there any special commands I need to issue to the CNI (as I see it is it just a PCI with a device server embedded)

    Mick
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 12, 2008
    znelbok, Jun 12, 2008
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  2. znelbok

    ashleigh Moderator

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    Can't be done with the standard CNI.

    Using some very specialised magic which is both unsupported and unsupportable, and not available via Toolkit, it MAY be possible. But there are no guarantees, especially for reliable operation. This is internal geek-speak. As far as a shippable, supportable product with known operation, characteristics, relaibility, etc. It can't be done.
     
    ashleigh, Jun 12, 2008
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  3. znelbok

    nexp

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    Sorry if I'm a little late to the party, but I was just struck by the statement that two CNIs cannot be used two bridge two networks. The USA literature for the CNI clearly states "Bridge multiple C-Bus networks together over LAN or WAN " as a feature. Is this a new development, or is the literature mistaken?
     
    nexp, Mar 19, 2009
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  4. znelbok

    ashleigh Moderator

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    Sounds like the literature is incorrect.

    CNI is used to feed an ethernet based control device, talking standard serial protocol, into the CNI which takes the standard serial protocol, and converts to cbus.

    Standard serial protocol is not inter-bridge protocol. Inter-bridge protocol exists only inside bridges and is not exposed to the outside world (ever).

    So if the literate says what you say it says, then its not right. Seems like a misunderstanding.
     
    ashleigh, Mar 19, 2009
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  5. znelbok

    nexp

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    nexp, Mar 19, 2009
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  6. znelbok

    znelbok

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    That would be a nice feature to add though - it would accomplish everything talked about in this thread.

    Mick
     
    znelbok, Mar 20, 2009
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  7. znelbok

    ashleigh Moderator

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    It would, wouldn't it.... mwah hah hah
     
    ashleigh, Mar 20, 2009
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  8. znelbok

    KevinH

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    We have produced a C-Bus to Ethernet embedded gateway which speaks the xAP protocol on Ethernet. xAP is a 'free' lightweight UDP based protocol that allows C-Bus integration with many automation applications , controllers and devices as long as they too speak xAP. A sort of Esperanto for automation control if you like. This is a great way of integrating C-Bus with many third party devices and most of the leading home automation applications now support xAP, including CQC - as mentioned earlier in this thread.

    Using two of these gateways you could achieve what you wanted provided you had a fibre Ethernet segment in place - although it wouldn't be very cost effective. WAN bridging of xAP via TCP is possible too. The latter would be far better served by a full C-Bus bridge though rather than a protocol translation to xAP and back.

    We are a C-Bus Enabled partner and due to some revisions in the way that program operates we are preparing our product for formal approval testing over the next few months.

    Cheers Kevin
     
    KevinH, Mar 24, 2009
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  9. znelbok

    jboer

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    Hey All,

    In my never ending quest to make C-Bus more usable and scopable in the increasing 'everything over ethernet' world, I am revisiting this idea of running the C-Bus bridge over fiber. I am fortunate enough to have a number of bridges that I can sacrifice to the cause.

    Firstly I was wondering if anyone has tried this yet?

    Also to those in the know, I am wondering if it is worth my time. Would people be interested in the outcome? Or how much has Schneider got on their radar for a C-Bus to Ether bridge, it has to be one of the most requested products looking at this forum and talking to people?

    Anyway, I have ordered a couple of these:

    http://au.rs-online.com/web/p/fibre-optic-transmitters/1711600/

    http://au.rs-online.com/web/p/fibre-optic-receivers/0446150/

    and from what I can see it will be a pretty easy conversion, yes I know the current available might be a little low, but if I have to build a little board that feeds the fiber and optos then that is easy.

    Thoughts from others?

    J
     
    jboer, Mar 26, 2016
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  10. znelbok

    rhamer

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    You'll also need one of these......:)

    image.jpeg

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Mar 26, 2016
    #50
  11. znelbok

    rhamer

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    As for a more sensible reply, I would see the fibre connectivity a bit limited.
    You would need to dedicate a fibre just for this task and apart from isolation between buildings or similar, there is not much else I can think of.

    I think if you were really serious you should look at a TTL serial to Ethernet device that has tunnelling capabilities between 2 devices.
    That way the communication is then a proper IP protocol and can be routed through a normal Ethernet network as required.
    In addition you also have all the normal Ethernet media options such as fibre available as needed.

    However, I know nothing about the internal bridge side to side protocol, and how resilient it is to networking type delays that would be introduced doing it this way.

    Cheers

    Rohan
     
    rhamer, Mar 26, 2016
    #51
  12. znelbok

    jboer

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    Hey Rohan,

    Totally agree, that is my next step, however in most new installations where I design systems there is plenty of fibre cores that are available going to most places that you would want to have a connection anyway. This is a quick and easy (hopefully) first step to expanding the capabilities.

    I was just looking at a simple MAX chip circuit, then either going into a Lantronics or Moxa box/card which they can do the tunnel easily. That will be the next step, I have a CTC talking C-Bus over ethernet doing a simular thing, so to have a bridge doing the same would be great.
     
    jboer, Mar 26, 2016
    #52
  13. znelbok

    bmerrick

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    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2016
    bmerrick, Mar 26, 2016
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  14. znelbok

    jboer

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    jboer, Mar 26, 2016
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