12 Channel DIN Relay wont talk!!

[JYoung]

Hi guys,

I am relatively new to C-Bus and would appreciate if anyone out there has any ideas on how to get a 12 Ch voltage free DIN relay (with power supply) to talk to the C-Bus Network. It worked just fine (could see it via PC Interface and program it) and then suddenly overnight decided that it would not communicate with any other devices on the network (No C-bus status light). It also killed the C-Bus network lights on all devices when connected and I could not communicate with the PCInterface. All of the channels work just fine turning each relay on and off manually, but it cannot be seen by the C-Bus Diagnostic or Installation apps via the PC interface. I have excluded cabling as the problem and checked things like network burdens (software burden active on PCInterface, Address 01h), clock generation (four sources on the network) etc.
Network consists of PCInterface, 2x 4 Channel Analog Output 0-10V, 9x 8 Channel Dimmers, 3x 4 Channel Dimmers (Powered) and 3x 12 Channel Relays (Powered). No light switches yet. Every other device still works perfectly.

I have tried with just the PC interface and the relay alone, but the PC interface wont power up from the relay. Tried the relay on one CBUS connection to the PCInterface and the rest of the network on the other connection to power the PCInterface to get power and C-Bus network, but still couldn't get the relay to talk.

Is there a way to force the device to talk, or is it just stuffed???!!!

Any ideas or help greatly appreciated..... Cheers

Jason

[Michael]

No C-Bus light can only mean one of 2 things......

No Clock ..........

~OR~

Lack of C-Bus Voltage .......

Can you put the unit into learn mode??
What is the voltage measured with a multimeter??

Generally it would be preferalbe to have an output unit at address $01 with a burden enabled, this would eliminate comms issues if someone were to remove the PCI.

Michael

[JYoung]

Thanks for the reply Michael.

There is an active clock on the network (the PC Interface at 01h) with the burden. The relay also has its own CBUS power supply. All relay channels work just fine manually turning lights on and off. Is there a way to put the unit into learn mode without being able to communicate with it?

Cheers and Thanks for the comments

Jason

[Michael]

You can put a unit into learn mode by holding down any local toggle button for 10 seconds.

To exit hold down any local toggle button for 2 seconds.

[JYoung]

Thanks again Michael.

The unit will go into learn mode OK, but still won't communicate with the rest of the network. There is not really any information in the Clipsal Literature (on the website) with respect to learn mode.

I have called my supplier and hope that they can shed some more light on it this week. Otherwise I will still keep trying stuff till then.

Cheers

Jason

[Alex]

Surprisingly I had a very similar thing occur to one of my relay units a few days ago. Manual operation via the unit buttons worked fine, but when the unit was plugged into the C-Bus, neither it nor any other unit worked - all C-Bus lights were out except one.

It happened immediately after powering off the entire system to carry out some maintenance, leading me to think I had somehow damaged that unit by the way I turned everything off. But that didn't turn out to be the case ...

It took me a while to figure out how to get inside the offending unit (glued together - what are they trying to hide?), but tenacity paid off, and guess what I found - a wire sitting where it shouldn't!

Removing the wire fixed the unit, and may explain the problem I had observed since the day the system was installed (2 years ago) whereby occasionally the C-Bus lights on some units would flash for no apparent reason (they no longer do this). At the time, the installer assurred me that was normal ...

For the record, here's the evidence. You should be able to spot the guest wire resting at top left of the board.

[Duncan]

It took me a while to figure out how to get inside the offending unit (glued together - what are they trying to hide?), but tenacity paid off, and guess what I found - a wire sitting where it shouldn't!


Jason... please dont pull your unit apart, needless to say the warranty will be voided.. if the unit still isnt working correctly contact Clipsal Technical Support in your country.

[ashleigh]

The unit covers are not glued on to hide anything. Think about it for a moment....

The holes are there to assist airflow and cooling, but it has been known for bits of wire to fall into units due to a lack of care during the electrical wiring stage.

Just to emphasise an important point - please take care to prevent dirt, bits of wire, dust, plaster, water and other crap falling into the units. Generally these don't mix well with electronics.

[JYoung]

Thankyou Alex, Duncan & Ashleigh for your comments. I will unwire the unit and turn it over to see if anything foreign comes out. Although I have taken best care not to get anything in the units when wiring, it only takes one lapse in vigilance for things to happen. Not to say that this is the problem, but I will try any easy fix. Otherwise, I have already contacted my supplier to investigate further for me.

I do not wish to open this thing up. I have far too many other things to put together a the moment to add another one to the list.

Cheers & Thanks

Jason

[znelbok]

tip for those who may not have thought of it yet

put some tape across the vent holes during installation to prevent forien matter from getting in - just dont forget to remove it.

I have had the exact same problem with a din aux input, lost comms, although it all worked OK. Pulled it out and tested it on the bench and still nothing, gave up after that, it was only 2 months old as well.

[ashleigh]

tip for those who may not have thought of it yet

put some tape across the vent holes during installation to prevent forien matter from getting in - just dont forget to remove it.

Sounds like a good idea to me.

I have had the exact same problem with a din aux input, lost comms, although it all worked OK. Pulled it out and tested it on the bench and still nothing, gave up after that, it was only 2 months old as well.
Sounds like its suitable for a warranty return.