Confused?? Homegate and CQC

[skyline]

Can anyone out there in a nutshell explain the differences between both software packages? As I understand, Homegate can deliver a customisable GUI for a CBus installation whereas CQC provides this in addition to controlling other 3rd party products.

Any info would be appreciated.

Cheers
Daniel

[froop]

I don't have any real experience with Homegate, but my understanding is that its primary purpose as you stated, is to provide a customisable GUI for a CBus network.

CQC's primary purpose is to provide a framework on which to built a fully customised home entertainment and automation environment. The ability to interface to CBus is via one of many purpose built drivers for third party devices.

[Darpa]

HomeGate is CIS (Clipsal)'s own product for control of a C-Bus network via a local or remote PC.

Charmed Quark (CQC) is not made, sold, or supported by CIS, and is entirely a third-party product.

For more information about Homgate, refer to: http://www2.clipsal.com/cis/technical/product_groups/cbus/software/homegate

For more information about CQC, refer to:
http://www.charmedquark.com/Web/Overview/Overview.htm

Or, if you can get hold of him, try having a chat with rhamer (Rohan) on here, as he is basically out resident expert on CQC, and can most definately explain the differences and advantages between HomeGate and CQC, although be aware that he is DEFINATELY a CQC fanboy, and as such is very biased towards it :p

Best of luck in making your decision between the two :)

Darpa

[znelbok]

Basically, if you only have C-bus, then Homegate will work for you.

If you have anything else that you want to integrate such as a Ness M1, TV's, Amps. Air Con's etc then you will need something that will give the ability to "talk" with them. This is what CQC does.

I personally use CQC with my C-Bus, M1 and Air con and a few other things all through a central touch screen. Integration is great. Arm the alarm and everything turns off (lights, A/C, TV). A/C can be turned on via SMS, lights come on when garage door is opened and lights a path to door - you get the idea.

Lots of conditionals possible because of the extended integration. i would recommend CQC over Homegate for that reason. There is a great user community for CQC as well to help you along your way.

I am not sure about Homegate, But CQC is a server client install, so if you want an extra screen somewhere, you just install it point it to the server and everything is there for you - no new license, no added cost.

There are about 6 users in Aus that I can think of - a couple frequent here as well.

I'd also class myself as a fanboy just like Rohan, but Rohan is the CQC C-bus guru as he wrote the driver for it.

Mick

[skyline]

Thanks for all your replies... Yes would like to control more than just CBus as I have the M1G installed also. I have downloaded the trial software so will have a bit of a tinker.

Off track- Is the v2 CBus interface for the M1G available and is the V1 upgradable? I have the v1 interface so would be great if it's just a firmware upgrade.

Cheers
Daniel

[rhamer]

You won't ever hear me knock Homegate, I believe it is horses for courses and my particular course is best suited to CQC.

It's as the others have said, C-Bus is just one of my automation systems and I want to have a package that handles them all. CQC does this for me and given I (or anyone) can write drivers for any devices that are not currently in the list, it makes it my choice for a package (as well as a stack of other reasons).

I can't really comment on homegate these days as it's been quite a while since I have looked at it. I have however recently found myself taking on some programming of the Colour C-Touch for a friend, so I guess I'll get to know it again soon.

BTW it is true that I wrote the C-Bus driver for CQC, but Mick (znelbok) probably has more experience in both systems.

Cheers

Rohan

[paulw11]

Off track- Is the v2 CBus interface for the M1G available and is the V1 upgradable? I have the v1 interface so would be great if it's just a firmware upgrade.

Cheers
Daniel

Hi Daniel,

Yes the V2 C-Bus interface is available but I'm afraid that you cannot upgrade a V1 to a V2 via firmware, it is new hardware.

Ness did have an "upgrade deal" for a while but as far as I know it ended in September last year. You can always ask though...

[znelbok]

Since you have an M1 you should really have a good look at CQC as it supports it as well.

The V2 board is a V2.1 now. You have the V1 which means you have a serial expander as well. That will not be needed with the V2 board as it connects to the M1 and the Ethernet expander connects to the V2 board.

Mick

[fleetz]

Since you have an M1 you should really have a good look at CQC as it supports it as well.

The V2 board is a V2.1 now. You have the V1 which means you have a serial expander as well. That will not be needed with the V2 board as it connects to the M1 and the Ethernet expander connects to the V2 board.

Mick

Hi Mick,

What does the 2.1 do over the 2 version? Are Ness offer a firmware upgrade at board level?

Cheers

Fleetz

[znelbok]

2.1 fixes an error in the code. The unit would echo commands on the network.

The new V2.1 with a 2 led sim appears to be doing the same thing from my testing.

Try changing a group a few times in quick succession and see if it keeps changing - its probably the M1 doing it.

If you have not seen it yet then dont worry about it.

Mick
Hi Mick,

What does the 2.1 do over the 2 version? Are Ness offer a firmware upgrade at board level?

Cheers

Fleetz

[Nathan]

i spent some time with ness fault finding the echo problem and found that you must have all cbus groups entered into the m1 lighting section with the opt box ticked on all groups. even if your m1 doesnt need the cbus groups to control they have to be in the lighting section with the opt box ticked. there will be an update on rp soon that will fix or update users of having to do this.
hope this helps

[fleetz]

Hi Mick and Nathan,

Thanks for the feedback.

I am about to start the final installation of M1 and CBus gear in the next few weeks. House is nearly at lock up.

I have the gear all wired up and doing the programming now. I actually imported all the lighting groups into RP the other day and had a quick chance to check it out. I did notice some erroneous switching which I was going to look into and it sounds like the issue you guys are experiencing.

I hope the Ness guys are on top of this as the whole house is C-Bus. They have been very good to date and I am sure they will nail it.

Nathan did they give you and indication as to the expected release of the fix? Do you know if it will require the 2.1 firmware as part of the fix? Interesting I can't find any reference to 2.1 on the Ness M1 forum.

Are Ness upgrading the 2.0 boards to 2.1 on return to base basis??

Thanks again guys.

Regards,

Fleetz

[fleetz]

Hi Mick and Nathan,

Thanks for the feedback.

I am about to start the final installation of M1 and CBus gear in the next few weeks. House is nearly at lock up.

I have the gear all wired up and doing the programming now. I actually imported all the lighting groups into RP the other day and had a quick chance to check it out. I did notice some erroneous switching which I was going to look into and it sounds like the issue you guys are experiencing.

I hope the Ness guys are on top of this as the whole house is C-Bus. They have been very good to date and I am sure they will nail it.

Nathan did they give you and indication as to the expected release of the fix? Do you know if it will require the 2.1 firmware as part of the fix? Interesting I can't find any reference to 2.1 on the Ness M1 forum.

Are Ness upgrading the 2.0 boards to 2.1 on return to base basis??

Thanks again guys.

Regards,

Fleetz

Found the reference to it on the Ness Forum it was under a thread I started there!

[znelbok]

The latest (and previous) of RP allows you too import the toolkit XML file so you get all groups loaded. There is now a check box added to the current to allow you to have the opt box ticked when it does this as well.

I think most of what Nathan has mentioned has been done in the latest version.

The V2.1 board is still having problems in my opinion, but only the 2 LED sim board, not the newer 3 LED board.

Even with all groups added to RP you will get echoing - which is sounds like you have. Get onto Ness about sending your back so they can update the firmware - but be warned that you may still have the problem.

The opt tick is to allow commands to be sent at a higher speed then would otherwise be possible. It was initially done for X10 where there was a second between commands, now with newer systems you can sends commands faster - and this is what it enables, commands to be send a whole lot faster.

Mick

[Nathan]

I was told the opt tick allows two way C-bus groups and had no reference to the x10 older features.

Yeah send the v2.0 back as it has some issues and they should swap it over to the v2.1.

Ever since i have had all the groups in the lighting section and they are all tick in the opt box i have had no problems.

Any one else having issues still?

[fleetz]

Hi Nathan,

Thanks for the feedback. I was running 1.6.22 and I saw Mick and your comment about ticking the opt box...what Opt box then I realised 1.6.24 had been released. Upgraded to that version and the echoing problem has on the surface dissappeared. The test to date are by no means extensive but seem encouraging.

What I have noticed is that if you do a bunch of C-Bus GA changes and M1 is off line and then you connect M1 via C-Bus then synchronise any RM devices that the differnce between what is actually on/off compared to what any updated RM device is totally different.

For example if you have 25 GA devices on and say via C-Bus diagnostic you switch all GA off in application 56 then go to the RM and synchronise it and then look at RM status in lighting you will see many of the GA address still on. C-Bus Diagnostics is sending valid C-Bus instructions so M1/RM should follow and update especially after a synchronise. Have you seen the same??

I will arrange with Ness to do the swap upgrade to V2.1.

What other things had you noticed from V2.0 to V2.1?

Regards,

Fleetz

[znelbok]

I was told the opt tick allows two way C-bus groups and had no reference to the x10 older features.


Refer to the Ness forums for the answer from Greg there re this issue (speed of rules).

I had two way comms without the opt box ticked, just very slow comms.

fleetz

The V2.1 update is only supposed to fixes the echoes. No other features were added as far as I am aware.

Mick